Welcome to the Catholic Sobriety Podcast, the go-to resource for women seeking to have a deeper understanding of the role alcohol plays in their lives. Women who are looking to drink less or not at all for any reason. I am your host, Christie Walker. I'm a wife, mom, and a joy filled Catholic, and I am the Catholic sobriety coach, and I'm so glad you're here.

 Today I'm very honored to welcome my new friend Sally. New to the. Podcast. Today, Sally and I share a few meaningful connections. We're both originally from Boise, Idaho. I now live in the state that she lived in, um, in Washington for a while. But even more than geography, we connected quickly through a shared faith and a heart for those who have lived in the shadow of addiction and are longing for peace.

 Sally grew up in a home that was deeply impacted by alcoholism with a childhood marked by chaos and instability. Very early on, she learned what it meant to be self-reliant and later what it means to be deeply in need of healing through her faith, Christian community, and years of lived experience.

Jesus began a beautiful restoration process that has shaped the work that she now offers others. She's a Christian life coach, a Catholic convert, a longtime member of Al-Anon, and someone who brings together faith, wisdom, and compassion in a really grounded way. Sally has a beautiful gift for helping people love someone struggling with addiction.

Without losing themselves and for teaching calm peace, protecting boundaries that do not rely on control, fear, or punishment. Her YouTube channel, you can find her YouTube channel at Sally New, and that's S-A-L-L-E-E-N-E-W. And I'll leave a link to her YouTube channel. In my, in my description, it's full of thoughtful, practical teachings.

And today, honestly, we're just gonna be able to kind of scratch the surface. Surface on the work that she does, so, so well. So welcome, Sally. I'm so happy to have you here today. I'm so glad to be here. So glad to be here. Well, why don't we just go ahead and get into it, and you help people move from chaos to peace, especially families touched by alcoholism.

So maybe you can. Explain a little bit for my audience what that chaos, chaos kind of looked like in your own life before things began to change, what that turning point was and when you realized that peace was actually possible for you. Yes. Thank you so much. I like to say that I came down the birth canal saying, is there a cupboard for me to clean?

I'll take those jeans in extra long. And whoever's been nearest AAN on meeting because I'm five 11, so always have to get extra long gene. He and was born straight into the lap of addiction. Both of my parents were full on alcoholics when I was born. Very different alcoholics. My mother was very, very functional, so she had her a alcoholism while my dad or a thing.

He was just off the rails drinking when he was drinking. When he wasn't drinking, he was pretty stable. So. I just came right into that environment and I remember at a very early age seeing a pretty hostile, let's put it that way, interaction between my parents. I was probably five and I was in the hallway, and I just knew that I was.

Like gonna be kind of on my own. Nobody here is gonna raise you. You are on your own. And of course, I wasn't completely on my own, I was still raised by my parents and my mother still took back the reams. But eventually I realized as I grew older. As a young adult, I wanted out of that environment, I needed to be out of the house because it never stopped.

It never stopped until I left the house. Both of my parents were still drinking. My dad found recovery. My mom actually died of alcoholism many years later. But, um, I needed out and my best friend from high school introduced me to the Lord at an Assembly of God church in Boise, Idaho. And that was when I knew.

That I had found the way to peace, and that was to get closer to Jesus. And I remember being in that community and just seeing the people worshiping and praising and I could remember seeing their faces and thinking, this is what I want and this is what I need. So that began, began. I walk with the Lord and later, after I met my husband and we moved to South Louisiana.

Went to a Catholic life and the Spirit seminar just to be polite and walked into the church. And I'm like, what? No, no. Are you here? So am naive. So clueless. And I remember looking at the tapping up, going, there's nothing about this. And they're like, no, this can't, this is what you're saying. Because my husband and I had been looking for a church.

No. And my husband, who was Deep Water Baptist, the next 90 night, he was like dressed in room and I think I had a, a cold or something. I'm like, I don't wanna go. And he said he don't wanna go. And like, we're good. So we, we skipped a week, but then we went back the next week and pretty soon it was like, this is where I'm calling you.

So we converted. We spent the next 30 years working in the Catholic charismatic gran ministering and working at a house of prayer and many things. So that's how I came to find the Lord and to find that there was another way. To live than the way that I grew up, but it took many years of inner healing, a lot of work on my part, my forgiveness work.

I don't even know how many forgiveness prayers I've said, and a lot of making amends, a lot of owning my own behavior. That felt short that I realized as time went on. You know, you're not, you're not measuring up here. It was a long, it was a long, it was a process for me, but I can tell you that there is no hurt.

There is no brokenness that Jesus can't heal. Mm-hmm. Now, none. And as Catholics, I believe we have the advantage of the sacraments. And of course our Protestant brothers and sisters have, they still know the Lord as well. Like you have to be Catholic to be restored after growing up in an home that I'm so grateful that I am and that this is where the Lord has led me.

That's beautiful, Sally. And you're right, there's, I mean, we just get so many graces from the sacraments and it is so powerful and wow. I appreciate you sharing your story and as you were talking about your childhood, I was just thinking it's probably. It was probably like you never knew what version of your parents you were going to get or like how you were supposed to act.

It sounds very, um, I mean, yes, chaotic, but also it probably, I'm guessing that it also taught you how to read people because you had to so much. I know that there was a lot of negative things, but what were some positive things that that experience? Gave you that you actually can use now? Well, you know, this is what I think that no parent decides to become an alcoholic and neglect their children.

That's not what they enter marriage or having children with the thought of. So my parents didn. Intentionally do that. We know that alcoholism and addiction is a brain disease. It's something very physical. And so it, it wasn't on purpose that they behaved the way that they did. And uh, and they were also very affectionate.

And that's one thing I had that some adult children about colleagues don't have. I could go up to my mom or my dad at any time and say, put my arms around and say, you know, I love you. Give him a kiss on the cheek or whatever, and that was always very welcome. So I'm very thankful for that. And it taught me definitely to be a, there's no doubt about it.

I mean, I entered young adult hood knowing that no one was going to bail me out. There was really nobody that I could turn to. Accept the Lord, of course, in my Christian community. And later I learned how to develop a support system. So like today I have a Spur director. I have a counselor. I've had a life coach before.

Had a 12 step sponsor. Have prayer partners, all of them, and I rely on them all. At that time, I didn't really know that I needed a support system, but I did learn how to rely on myself and then how to translate that into faith, if that makes sense. Like, um, okay, Lord, I don't have any other choice but you, like, I even have another choice.

So. I have to trust you. I have to trust you. And, and that's kind of what my walk was like. Um, so those were very positive things that I took. I'm very grateful for my background because it has developed a strength in me that otherwise would not be there, and I try to impart that to my, I have a son and a daughter-in-law and three beautiful grandchildren.

I'm, I'm not like your , your basic cookie baking grandma. I mean, I'm, I'm like your life coaching 12 step. Let's pull out the 12 step Bible and let's do a Bible study. Now, what is best say, I kind of, kind of let that go because I was, , let's talk. We're start on the first step. You know, we were powerless.

Our lives had become a night. What do you feel powerless like, huh? Maybe that's a little much. But I just tell them, you've got to trust the Lord. You have to trust the Lord. And I try to report that strength to them. Life isn't gonna be easy. You'll have challenges.

You'll have ups and downs. People will disappoint you, people will betray you, and you'll have to deal with, you'll have to forgive and you'll have to learn how to move on. So I would say that that's been extremely, extremely positive and I'm very grateful for them. The strength and the healing, of course, that the Lord has done in my life.

My dad and I took my care of my dad before he died. We were together for six months and I like to say that there was not, and I love you. That wasn't said. There was not, and I forgive you. That wasn't said. And at one point he came to the Lord right before he died and he said, and then he became Catholic.

It was so exciting, like, oh, I wanna stay 45 days before he died. He was like, I really wanna join the church, but I don't have time to go through the class. So fortunately the hospice, um, pastor was a priest and we were able to, he did whatever he had to do to bypass the rules and, um, bless my dad and invite him and confirm him into the church.

So nothing was left unsaid. A little different with my mom because she did die unexpectedly of alcoholism. Still had a little more emotions to work out, but they're both home safe now. I'm so grateful for that and. Like I said, they gave me gifts just in the natural as well. So there's, there's a lot of positive, there's a lot to be grateful for.

Mm-hmm. Yes. Thank you for sharing that. I just, I think it's so important to look at how God takes our, you know, our trauma, our missteps, even, you know, the things that we've done and things that have been done to us, and. He can, when we turn to him, when we surrender to him, when we give them to him, how he can make beauty out of that.

And I know that, I've seen that in my own life, and that's something that I think really connected me to you was just your joyful spirit, your positive energy, and just the way your, just, your heart for others. And, um, yeah. So I'm, I'm so glad you shared that and I'm so happy that you are able to mend. Mend that relationship with your dad and, um, you know, see him received into the church and, you know, just know the Lord in general I think is just such a beautiful, beautiful gift.

And, um. You, you touched on forgiveness, and I think that that's so important. You were talking about how you just kept having, you know, it's, it's an ongoing thing, right? It's absolutely not a one and done absolute event. And I think sometimes we think that, right? We're like, oh, but I forgave them a long time ago for that.

But there's still those wounds and so. I think a, there's a lot of misconceptions with forgiveness. Like we think we ha it ha we have to feel something to forgive and we don't, it's a verb, it's an action, it's a choice. We think that, you know, we just forgive and then that should take care of it. But really it's something things resurface and we have to forgive again and something resurfaces and we have to give again, forgive again.

And it could be the exact same thing that we forgave. Before. Right. And that's probably a lot of the work that you do with people, I would imagine, to help them kind of find that peace as well. So you teach people how to love someone who is an active addiction without losing themselves. So what are some of those ways that a person can, you know.

Forgive even while that person is an active addiction or you know, set boundaries lovingly without losing themselves. 'cause it can be so consuming, especially if it's a child or someone very close to you that's on your mind all the time. Like, how can I fix it when really you can't. So can you kind of speak to that?

Sure. I think one thing that is important to understand is that compassion. Does not mean enabling, and it's very easy for women, I think, especially to get that confused. We feel like, um, to have, in order to have compassion, we want to help our addicted loved ones, and that's a normal, natural thing because honestly, watching someone destroy themselves.

With drugs or alcohol is one of the most painful, agonizing experiences that we can have because we understand the consequences. We understand that addiction and treated is usually fatal. So that's a very sobering thought. And so in reaction to that, sometimes you don't wanna go the other way, you know?

Well, um. I'll give you some money just to get you to buy or I'll buy you enough alcohol so you don't go into withdrawal or, um, you know, I mean, I haven't had personal experience with this per se. But just in general in my family have seen it go on. So I haven't really bought someone alcohol or that type of thing, but I can understand the temptation to do it because you're trying to keep this person from just completely, you know, erupting into disaster and in front of you.

And what happens when we do is we kind of intersect. God's process because what he's trying to do is draw that person to himself. And drugs, first of all, say of course, save their soul. Of course, that's always the most important thing. But in addition to that, draw them into health, physical, mental, emotional, spiritual health.

And a lot of times if we're busy bailing them out by. Know, providing some necessities that they should be getting for themselves. If they're of age, we short circuit that process and we interfere with them. It's called, kind of called reaching your bottom, but, um, that's kind of a good term because listen, if I hadn't been desperate, I wouldn't have come to the Lord.

I remember just thinking like, I could do something, I could do something, and then something just said. Go to that church with your friend, you know? So that was kind of the start for me. But there has to be a turning point, or this is going to continue to to devolve. And very often when we interfere and we quote unquote help, so when, excuse me, we facilitate the prolonging of the disease, unfortunately.

So what? The ways that we can help are to help with. Recovery related issues. So in other words, I can help you get into detox, you know, if you want help with that, I can help you find support. I can help you look into treatments and see what's available. Those are things that we can help with. You know, giving someone a place to live, especially I guess if you're talking about a child, giving them a place, giving them a place to use or drink, it's not really a good idea because then they don't have to solve the problem themselves.

And most of the time someone can't be an alcoholic or an addict by themselves. They need help from other people. And unfortunately, usually we give it out of the goodness of our heart and being misled. So. That is another place that Al-Anon became very valuable to me. And I loved, I never saw a conflict between my faith and Al-Anon because I saw Al-Anon as a framework for my behavior and for understanding where I stop and another person starts.

So it was there that I learned very, um, readily to tell. I mean, it was a process. Don't get me wrong, I'm not, you know, it's not just a magic thing you do. It doesn't just happen, but you have to work the steps. You have to go to the meetings, you have to expose yourself to the thinking. But it was there that I realized what my responsibility was and was not.

Does that answer your question? Mm-hmm. Yes. Yeah, it does. So. You talked about enabling, so it, how does someone know if they're enabling versus helping it? I think you, you said maybe doing something for the person that they could do themselves. Is that like the definition of enabling? I think it's one of them.

And you know, this is, it's a little bit tricky. So, and, and I think it depends on individuals, and this is where you need to seek the Lord, you know, and have that walk with the Lord yourself. Because I know in Al-Anon some people say, I will never, ever, ever give help to my addicted child, even if the children are involved.

Well, that's, to me, that's a little too harsh of a boundary, you know? I, I, I probably would see about giving help to the children in some way. You know, that I do think that it's an individual decision that each person has to make, but by and large, when we're talking about, um, I need money for clothes, for a job interview, then we can go to, I need money for a bus pass to go to treatment that I'm never gonna go to.

I need money for, uh, groceries. I would advise giving food versus paying or sending money for groceries because you don't know, chances are with an addict, that's where that money is going is to either drugs or alcohol. So, and there were situations. Even with parents Now, I didn't have that situation with my parents because my dad got sober when I was about 24, 25.

He was sober for 20 years, relapsed for five and sober for 10 before he died. And my mom never get sober. But she was highly functional and very. Self-reliant. So I never had my parents asking me for money for something to drink or food. But there are situations where people do have parents asking for that, and that can be a problem.

And of course, in a marriage situation. Uh, to me that's something that I'm not really well versed in. So I definitely think that's where counseling or coaching comes in, where you can have someone help you learn how to draw those boundaries. And a lot of these things I've also learned from my own.

Relationship with my counselor who has a specialty in family addiction, and he's been in recovery himself for 40 years and been Catholic for 35. So a lot of those things, when I do have questions about boundary issues, I go to him. I go to a 12 step sponsor. If there's something that I can't quite figure out how I feel about myself, that's where the support system comes in.

Mm-hmm. I just truly believe in support systems because sometimes it does depend on the individual situation. But by and large, if the person is an adult and if they can do it for themselves, it, you shouldn't be paying the rent. You shouldn't be paying the phone up. You shouldn't be putting gas in their vehicle if they're not working and they're not trying.

Now, with my children, you know, if they're trying to reach goals, there are times that I will help them reach a goal, but I'm not just going to, if they're just not doing. And you work towards reaching their goal themselves, then I'm not gonna be too excited about helping them reach nothing. That makes sense?

Mm-hmm. Does that, yeah. It does. And you know, and that's the thing I can speak from an addict perspective of you're so focused on what you can get and how you can get it. And because of the way the alcohol or other drugs affect our brains, affect our bodies. People can just be out of their minds and and think only of themselves.

So they want to get what it is that they need and that can, yeah. Does include lying. It can include hiding and it, but it's on a spectrum, right? There's like the people that are like your mom that are more functional. You know, I didn't get to that point. Thanks be to God where I was having to do those types of things, but I, I did lie and I did hide it, so I wasn't doing everything right, but then there's.

There are people who will do anything to get it, and it can be even a dangerous situation. They're stuffed or breaking in and things like that. So you're right. I mean, it definitely is a. Case by case basis, built on family dynamics, where that addict is in their journey, what type of things that they do or don't do to try to get help.

And that willingness to change doesn't come from. The outside, it comes from the person it comes from within. And so sometimes setting those boundaries, I mean, the worst thing I would say for me was losing trust with my mom, with my grandpa, with losing trust with my family and my friends. And I think that that was part of what pushed me into the willingness that I needed to get help and get sober.

And. Doing that and kind of just letting them know like, you've broken trust with me, so I can't do X, Y, Z for you. I would love to do that for you, but I can't trust that you will do what you say you're gonna do with the money. But like you said, you can do other things, maybe take them shopping or you know, whatever it is, just based on what will be helpful.

Especially if they're trying, maybe even rewarding their trying like, oh, you went to. Meetings or you went to detox and now you're out. Or I've seen you put in these, uh, job applications and you've actually gone to interviews, so now we can do this. You kind of have to step it, right? You can't just be like, here's all the trust.

Exactly. Back again. Exactly. And I think too, just, um, you know, we can draw punishing boundaries unless not that opinion. Doing that again. You know, I mean, those are punish those definitely when you're angry, when you're hurt, when you are afraid, it's easy to, to, to resort to that type of communication where you just like, you know, that's the end of that, you know?

Mm-hmm. And it, it's a process to learn how to respond calmly to only answer what's asked. One of the. Therapists that I like to listen to says no is a complete sentence. Yeah. And, um, that's important to learn. Usually it's very few words that you need to say and you just need to say them calmly and firmly.

One of the things that I found is helpful, what is it gonna hurt me to sit and listen, let finish. I wanna go on a diatribe, you know? 'cause it's not abusive, of course. That's where you say, you know, okay, I'm not gonna listen to abuse, of course. But if they're just trying to tell you something, let 'em talk till they're done and then you know, I'm gonna have to get back to you.

I need to think about that first. And if they continue or are still upset, you know, to a point you can let them continue. Again, this. Say the same thing. You know, I, I'm just not sure how I feel about that. Let me think about it a little bit and I'm gonna get back to you. Um, and also when you see, let's say, when, when you know that you're needing to draw a boundary with somebody, there have been some family members I've known I'd need to draw boundary with boundaries with, and I see the phone number come through.

Well, I don't have to answer because if I feel myself being triggered, I don't have to answer. I can let it go to voicemail. I can see what it's about or I can wait for the text message and I can think about it. And again, you can say that even in a text message. Mm-hmm. I need to think about this. Or, it's, A lot of times what I've done with an angry text message is just say, okay, and then that's it.

You know, they, if it goes on and, and you don't feel that you wanna respond or you wanna address it yet to say, okay. Again, and, and a lot of times that will help to diffuse and let you remove yourself from the drama long enough to see how you really do feel and what action you really want to take. And if you need to talk to somebody about that.

Sometimes I do, sometimes I don't. Sometimes I just need some time to think, calm down, pray. You know, sometimes I already know. I'm going to do and what the right thing is. Sometimes I don't, and when I don't, I don't hesitate to reach out for discernment. The Bible says in the multitude of counselors is much wisdom, and now you have to pick them well.

I firmly believe in support systems. So that's where that really comes in handy, and that's where Al-Anon, the right sponsor in Al-Anon can be extreme. Again, well chosen. And your sponsor in Al-Anon doesn't have to be your happily ever after sponsor. You don't have to marry your Al-Anon sponsor. You know, um, you don't have to marry your counselor or your spiritual director, even if it's time for a change or things are going in a different directions.

But, um. Learning to set boundaries without punishing or abandoning or a lot of drama or anger. It is a process. Mm-hmm. It does take some time and some work on our part. And you mentioned forgiveness. Just a little blurb on that too. 'cause my heart is just with you on that. I have a forgiveness list. I have a decade long, I say what I call a perpetual divine mercy chaplain.

It have. You know, five over six decades, and I just say that every night to remind myself that I really do want to pray for those people that you said you were going to pray for. As soon as you walk away, it's like, no, you know, you said you were gonna pray for them. You cannot be dishonest about that. But I go through a forgiveness list and I still forgive my mom and my dad, my dad and my stepmom, my sibling, my step siblings.

I kind of go through that every day because. I want to be sure that there is no residual looking back and thinking, you know, that was kind of crummy. You know, I just don't want that energy. I wanna say, Lord, this is your providence. I'm letting it go. Um, venge, I say that I want vengeance for anybody, but the viruses mentions his mind, says the Lord.

You know, we surrendered into his hands that there's something that needs to be made right. We trust that he will do that for us. So I am totally with you on that and that it's an ongoing thing. It's an ongoing thing, and it's not related to how I feel about them. It's not related to if I'm never gonna trust them in that area again.

I never have to trust them. And in some cases, never, depending on the situation, might not ever right to the person again. Yeah, sometimes you can, you can still forgive, but you don't have to have that reconciliation where you like are together again, because sometimes it's just not safe. And then the other thing is, you know, forgiving people who are not with us anymore, they're, they've already gone on.

You can still, like you were saying, you pray for your mom and your dad and, and everybody, and. You know, you can keep praying for those people. Or even if you didn't forgive them while they were on earth, you can still forgive them. Like, that's still important. And you know, God takes that and does with it.

He changes us and he can, you know, change things for them and, you know, in different ways that we don't even know. Absolutely. But I'm glad that you mentioned that. I love the idea of having that Divine Mercy chaplain as a way of that continual or perpetual forgiveness. I am glad that you mentioned that 'cause I was gonna ask you like, what are some ways, if a, if a parent is.

Struggling. Like they know that their child is in active addiction and they've tried so many things, or maybe they just see that it's starting to become a problem. What are some ways for them to pray for them? Because you and I both know that prayer is just so, so powerful. We look at St. Monica and you know how she just never gave up?

Up on St. Augustine and she just kept, kept going. And it can be discouraging when you're just praying and praying and praying and nothing changes. But just because it's not changing now doesn't mean that it won't change in the future. I mean, look at your dad and so there's always hope. So what would you, do you have any suggestions for those who have loved ones, whether that's children, husbands, parents, whatever.

Who are struggling with addiction, like how can we pray for them best? You know that? That's a great question. And of course there's a lot of ways, as Catholics, we have so many devotions and no Venus and Saints. Or specifically sort of, I guess the church designates them as having special graces to pray for things.

So there's different ways that we can pray. We were mentored by a priest who was the official exorcist for the Archdiocese of New Orleans. So we were steeped in deliverance prayer and in. Of, um, charismatic outreach and charismatic spiritual warfare, prayer, that type of thing. And this is what has become really close to my heart, is to go to the chap.

Go to the church, especially for those special intentions. And for me, I do say, um, a series of spiritual warfare prayers and just protection prayers, pleading the blood of Jesus over those that I love, that I'm concerned for, um, even naming out, you know, certain struggles that they're having and claiming Jesus' power and victory over that.

And I have. It's like a special thing that I've sort of come to reve in my heart as a way to lift up those loved ones with an extra punch, if you will. Because I go to the chapel and I kneel before the Lord and I say, Lord, you've got, again, I have nowhere to turn but you. I have nowhere, Lord, if you don't come through for me.

There's no hope. If you don't come through for my loved one, there's no hope. So I'm here and I'm begging you. I plead your blood over them. I place them in your Christ light. I come against everything that's coming against them right now that I know that they're struggling with. Sometimes I will, I pray in a way where I sever all ties in Jesus name that are not of you.

Let's say there. It could be my grandchildren or whatever, you know. One, to be very careful about who they're and who they're around in these days. It can get so wild and crazy and just severing any spiritual tie that perhaps my children and my grandchildren have. Formed with someone that I don't think is healthy or I sometimes, some cases, let's be honest, I know it's not healthy.

I can see it's not healthy and no casting dispersions on another person. Pray. I pray that that person be blessed and raised up and drawn to Jesus so that God's plan will be fulfilled in their life as well. You know, because it's all about. Fulfilling the plan that God has for our lives. And whenever addiction sidetracks someone you love for a while, you know, I think that's a good way to feel very, for me, it's very, I find great solace in it and I'm, I'm so thankful that as Catholic.

We have that. And in Phoenix here, especially where I live, there's a lot of churches. Very often it's easy to find a church that's open or a chapel that's open. You can go to the office and get the code, or you can go online and get the code or whatever. So you can go into the adoration chapel and you can kneel before the blessed sacrament.

So that has become very special to me. I don't hesitate to lay hands on them and pray for them much to their dismiss sometimes. I, I pray my rosary. I pray divine mercy chaplains. I, um, I just pray, Lord, please, I need your help. I pray. Sometimes I claim scriptures, I will pull a scripture apart and I'll say, Lord.

Right now I choose to believe this word. I'm choosing to believe it, even though I do not see the answer. I choose to believe it because this is what your word says. And so it's an ongoing walk with the Lord to, um, discover what the Lord is saying. There's a verse in, um, two Peter one 19 that I rely on very much.

We have the prophetic word. Made sure, which we do well to pay attention to, like a light shining in a dark place. And I always say, Lord, I need to know what you are saying because if I have what you are saying, I have your word on this issue, then I can move forward with confidence knowing that it's going to produce fruit, if that makes sense.

Or the verses that. Recently when my godmother died, she was a tremendous influence on my life. She was my spiritual mentor for many years. And when she died I felt a little out of sorts and I decided, what am I gonna do? I pulled it out 10 verses from the Bible that I felt really represented my faith in my walk with the Lord.

Words that I've gotten through the years or whatever, and that's one of my life verses if the birth I just shared. Because it's so important to me to know what the Lord says. How is he saying to pray? It's kind of all over the map on that. But how can he answer your question? Yeah, that was really, really helpful.

I feel like I need to have you back on some time to talk. We should talk inner healing because I am a graduate of a counter school of ministries. I think I told you that. Mm-hmm. And so that is like the prophetic physical healing, inner healing, um, type stuff. And I just. I think it's so important in just our healing in general, in being able to detach from those, detach from anything, those strongholds that are keeping us from the Lord and living in freedom.

'cause that's really what, um, alcohol and, you know, those types of things are. When you were talking, it just reminded me of like, the enemy will attack us even as people who are loving, someone who is struggling and the enemy will say lies to us. Like, they're never gonna get better. They're always gonna be this, they'll do, he'll do stuff like that to get us to stop, to get us to give up, to get us to, you know, waiver in God's.

Providence in his, uh, goodness, in his, you know, ability to heal. And so when you were talking about that, you know, I talked to my, my clients about renouncing lies and claiming the truth of like renouncing lies of I'll never get better or, you know, whatever it is. And then claiming the truth either by speaking scripture, like you said over ourselves.

Or just claiming the truth, like I am a beloved daughter of God. I know that he loves me. He has my best, um, in mind. He wants my freedom even more than I do, and things like that. So we can use that even as we're being attacked with those lies about our loved ones. Right. So when you were talking about that, that's, that just came up.

And then I think too, when you were talking, what came to mind as well? I feel like Holy Spirit kind of brought this to mind is to speak that truth and to speak life over our loved ones that are suffering in addiction. Like speak to them how you want them to be and let them know how very loved they are, even if they kind of poo poo it, or they just kind of like are like, yeah, yeah, whatever.

God loves me. But just really saying those things. Or if you give them a card, like writing a piece of scripture, like what you said. In that, that is encouraging, that really speaks to their identity because you bet that plant seeds, it doesn't have to be a lecture, it doesn't have to be an hour long conversation.

Just like a simple card. Like I'm thinking of you and I, and this came to mind, you know, like giving them a word. That the Lord maybe gave to you in adoration, like go to adoration and say, Lord, do you have a word for me to give to my loved one? And then just being able to give that to them. If it's encouraging to say, I believe in you.

You know I, yeah, you can do it. Believe in you. And I know that God has good things in store for you and they want to support you. I'm praying for you. Those types of things that let them know. That they are loved because it's, I have never struggled with addiction myself, so I have no frame of reference except for what I've been told, especially by my dad, you know?

Um, because my dad made a boatload of mistakes. I mean, he married a lot of them, and he told me once, he said, I can't get sober because when I turn over, it's like a black cloud. Gotta have face. Everything that I've done. And, um, you know, I had, again, when he told me if I was a teenager, I was like, but you, but you still can, you know, you.

I didn't really understand what that's like, but there's so much shame attached to it. They already feel ashamed. You know, they may tell you they don't, or they may tell you that they're living their best life, but you know. As I heard on the podcast, I was listening to this sweet, when I first started, smoked that weed at 14.

My goal wasn't to be living under a bridge using heroin in my twenties. You know, they didn't expect to be struggling with these things. So affirming who they are in the Lord, I think it's always valuable and always something that we can do and remind them that they are loved and then. That doesn't mean that we just throw all the boundaries out the window because we said we believed in them.

And, um, I think that that's, that is really important and I'm glad that you brought that up. Yeah. I think it's important to, to talk about before we close, 'cause we're getting to the end of our time and I could talk to you for so much longer, but can you just speak about breaking those generational patterns and.

What is it that can actually break that pattern? Is it behavior change, healing, faith, or is it something deeper? Because you talk about community and Al-Anon and and all of those, which are super important, but the work you do is very important as well. So as a coach, if you could kind of speak to that.

Well, and I think it's gonna depend on where each person is at as well, because some people perhaps may not. Know the Lord yet, or may haven't, maybe they haven't come to that place where they're comfortable with prayers. What I do do is I offer prayer. You know, I offer to start in the sessions with prayer, if they're comfortable with, and if they're, that's okay too.

You know, however they want to go about that. I believe that at the root, you've got to have, um, a spiritual life to be able to change. That's gonna be the. Most important thing. Then I think, um, emotional healing for the things that have happened perhaps in your life, throughout your life is going to be an important component.

Behavioral change is also going to be an important component, possibly environmental change depending on. Who you're hanging out with or where you're going and what you're doing. So I think it's multifaceted and it's going, it depends on the individual situation that each person comes with in terms of where they're at and also kind of where they're at in their understanding.

As Catholics, we have a deeper understanding of intergenerational healing, um, maybe even intergenerational bondage. And not everybody's there. Not everybody's ready for that or is going to understand exactly what you're talking, so you don't wanna go straight to that, you know, if it's not where they are yet either.

So kind of meeting each person where they are and seeing what is the most, um, prevalent. Need, if that makes sense. What is the most t need? And if it's a behavioral change, how are we going to go about accomplishing it? Do you need me as a life coach? There's times again that I felt like, um, we could incorporate someone else's expertise into this as well.

And sometimes, you know, this is something that I think you and I can work through ourselves. Turning to support groups and there's other types of 12 step support groups. Of course, there's adult children of alcoholics and in addition to Al-Anon, there's Coda. There's all kinds of 12 step groups that address any type of particular predilection for something that's not healthy and is not getting you where you wanna go in life.

So I do think, I think faith has got to be number one, but I think the other components. Kind of go together, and very often it's going to be multifaceted in terms of which is most important is going to depend on the person. Sometimes the feeling is going to be the most important because sometimes the behavior won't change.

Without the healing. And then sometimes the healing maybe has happened or maybe isn't as necessary and there is a behavioral change that needs to take place. Um, maybe a need for confession. Sometimes in our church, we have that blessing to be able to go and verbalize. I just love that. And that's really the fourth and fifth step ballon if you get right down to it, right?

It's the same thing. And Al-Anon, even as an organization that doesn't. Claim to be Christian understands the need to verbalize, um, when you've done something wrong. The importance of verbalizing it to kind of break the back of the power that it has over you. It's no longer a secret, it's something you're spoken.

So you are beginning that process of being set free. So I think it's multifaceted and I think the most important thing. The most important need is going to kind of depend on each individual and where they're at. And so coaching to me is a lot about listening. It's a love listening. You are there, you listen, you mirror, you brainstorm, you offer suggestions.

You gently lead that person, remind that person that God does, you know, depending again on where they're at. But I've God's love for them and of to plant hope in them. Everybody's looking for hope so. I don't know if that answered your question or if that was a little scattered, but I think it just really does depend on the individual.

Yeah, it does. And that, that's the beautiful thing about coaching. Like you were saying, it's a lot of listening, but it's also a lot of reflecting back because we will say things in coaching, and I know this from being coached myself, but then also being a coach. Sometimes I'll hear something that my client says and I'll pull that out and say, well, you.

You said this, and you know, we'll kind of talk about that. And they're like, oh my gosh. You know, and all of a sudden a light bulb comes on. So that's the thing. It's like the Lord has given us everything that we need and he continues to give us what we need. But sometimes when we're. Stuck. It can almost feel, be like there's a veil over it or kind of a cloud and we can't quite see it.

We can't quite make it out. And so when someone else can kind of pull that out and say, but you, you said this, what do you think about this? Or How do you think this could help? Or, you know, asking those questions that kind of get us thinking in a way that we wouldn't. Think ourselves, or we wouldn't ask ourself that question.

And that can really lead to breakthroughs and those kind of moments of like, oh my gosh, yeah, that that will work. Because as coaches, if we just sat there and told people what they needed to, like, I could develop a program and say, you need to do this, this, this, and this. That's not necessarily gonna work for everybody, right?

Because we're all different and our lives are different. Our backgrounds are different. It's more about being able to find something, find that unique. Thing that works for each individual and that's what's so beautiful and I love that you said, you know, it's not always just one thing. I have a lot of clients that do counseling and coaching and it's because it's two different, completely different things.

As coaches, we don't necessarily do like delve into a lot of the trauma or the background and that kind of thing. We are like. Yes. Sometimes that stuff comes up and yes, sometimes it needs to be kind of dealt with or talked about, but really we're like, okay, this is where you're at and how do we move forward?

That's why I love the name of your coaching, faith Forward Coaching, 'cause that it just has that visual in the name like, okay, we're starting from faith and we're moving forward. Praise God. And I just, I just love that so much. And also, and reminding each person that there is hope for them. And yes, I do like to think of their qualities that I could see in them just from a conversation.

You know, I see this strength in you, I see this compassion, or this intuition, or this wisdom. Because everybody has gifts and we all need to be encouraged to just be able to give someone the hope and the encouragement that you are there for them and you believe in them with, you know, you're there for 'em.

You can go to the Mac forum in terms of your belief for them and being there to mirror, to brainstorm, to support, to listen to, um, that type of thing. I think that that is really important. Just to encourage people and let them know that there's hope for them. There's hope. Oh, absolutely. And what I always like to remind people is we have all been given gifts, spiritual gifts.

You know, at the time of our baptism, that nurture us, that enable us, that help us to do the thing that we need to do to strengthen us. So I always like to say, just ask for an increase in that. Ask for, you know, whatever it is, is it. Counsel, is it wisdom, is it knowledge? All of these things. And then you'll start seeing those fruits of the spirit come up as well.

And um, and you know, the Lord just uses it in such beautiful ways and just, I always ask for an outpouring of grace. So just ask for those things, especially in times when you are really struggling, when the worry feels like it's about just to like come down on you. Um. The Lord is there for, for us. And I love that you said like that faith is the foundation.

I don't, I know people can't get sober without God, but I just don't know how they do it. And I don't know how it sticks for them. Because without my relationship with the Lord, I know that I wouldn't be where I am today. I'd be, I might not even be here actually, to be quite honest with you. But I am so happy that you were here today and all the time that you've given.

Thank you so much given me today. And I definitely wanna have you back. I think that we should talk about inner healing and, and forgiveness and stuff, maybe on an a future podcast episode. I'd love that some time. But why don't you go ahead and tell people like where they can find you. I told them about your YouTube channel, but if you wanna talk more about that, you can.

Um, if you have any like. Resources or anything. The floor is yours, Sally. Just tell them whatever. Thank you so much. Well, I would love it if you would check out my YouTube channel. It's a new channel and the name of it is Faith Forward Coaching with the numeral one after it, because a couple of other people had taken Faith Forward Coaching, so had to add a one.

And then if you spell my name, S-A-L-L-E-E-N-E-W, uh, it will come up. I have a free document on there, and it has a three step process that you can just surrender anything that you're struggling with, loved ones at addiction, alcoholism, or any other problem that you. Just feeling like you can't let go of or you don't know what to do next with, and that's a free document and you can schedule a 20 minute discovery call with me as well.

And my coaching services are available there. All the information is there. So I would love it if you would check out my chat and um. Look at a couple of videos and just let, give me some feedback. And I always say, you know, reach out to me in the comments. Let me know what's going on with you. Be glad to pray for you promise.

We'll pray for you if you leave me a prayer intention in the comments, because that's what we need is if we don't have somebody, if we have somebody to pray for us, we can make it through anything. We can make it through anything. We need to band together and support each other in that way. So I'm just so grateful to have been here today.

Um, thank you so much for letting me share and I appreciate so much your walk, your journey with the Lord, your witness. We cast outta your recovery, your hope. Uh, it's a beautiful thing and um, I'm just so glad that we were able to connect. Who knows what the Lord has in store for us, you know, along our journey and the beautiful ways he weaves our lives together and for His glory, of course.

So thank you so much for letting me be part of this podcast. I really appreciate it. Oh, you're welcome. Thank you for being here, here, Sally. Yeah. I really think it's divine providence that we were able to meet and connect and, and can share. And, um, yeah, I, it was such a blessing having you here and I will talk to you again soon.

Okay. God bless.

 Well, that does it for this episode of the Catholic Sobriety Podcast. I hope you enjoyed this episode and I would invite you to share it with a friend who might also get value from it as well, and make sure you subscribe so you don't miss a thing. I am the Catholic sobriety coach, and if you would like to learn how to work with me or learn more about.

The coaching that I offer, visit my website, the Catholic sobriety coach.com. Follow me on Instagram at the Catholic Sobriety Coach. I look forward to speaking to you next. Time and remember, I am here for you. I am praying for you.